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Jack Carr - Navy SEAL Turned Savage Son Author - Jack Carr is a best-selling author of the Terminal List series of books. His latest book Savage Son opened as a best-seller. BTW, before conquering the world of storytelling, Jack was a commander in with the Navy SEALs. So when he writes about thrillers, he's speaking from experience.
Get the audible, kindle or hardback versions of Savage Son Here Fellow Best-Selling author Scott Huesing joins Pete A Turner hosting Jack on the Break It Down Show. Jack talks about the deal he agreement he made with Chris Pratt to have Chris star and Executive Producer the Terminal List TV series. Haiku The Terminal List Books from Navy SEAL Jack Carr Produced by Chris Pratt Similar episodes: Dan Crenshaw https://youtu.be/74UQ6JKQO1w Johnny Walker https://youtu.be/2_TbRcNBTNw Sawman Sawyer https://youtu.be/zkmzSwhyr64 Join us in supporting Save the Brave as we battle PTSD. www.savethebrave.org |
Executive Producer/Host/Intro: Pete A. Turner https://youtu.be/mYoUxRJzXcA
Producer: Damjan Gjorgjiev
The Break It Down Show is your favorite best, new podcast, featuring 5 episodes a week with great interviews highlighting world-class guests from a wide array of topics. Get in contact with Pete at www.peteaturner.com www.breakitdownshow.com
Producer: Damjan Gjorgjiev
The Break It Down Show is your favorite best, new podcast, featuring 5 episodes a week with great interviews highlighting world-class guests from a wide array of topics. Get in contact with Pete at www.peteaturner.com www.breakitdownshow.com
Transcription
Pete Turner 0:00
Hey everybody Pete a Turner, executive producer and host of your break it down show I've got a hell of a show for you today you are going to be able to say I knew this guy before he really, really made it big. And not that jack cars not already huge because he's a multi time best seller. With his terminal list series of books. His latest book is called savage sun, it just came out. Also it's spread by Ray Porter, who's the basically the number one audible reader so if you're an audible person, one sign up through the break it down show to always get your books either break it down show but three, you are going to love savage sun, I've read the book.
Hey everybody Pete a Turner, executive producer and host of your break it down show I've got a hell of a show for you today you are going to be able to say I knew this guy before he really, really made it big. And not that jack cars not already huge because he's a multi time best seller. With his terminal list series of books. His latest book is called savage sun, it just came out. Also it's spread by Ray Porter, who's the basically the number one audible reader so if you're an audible person, one sign up through the break it down show to always get your books either break it down show but three, you are going to love savage sun, I've read the book.
Pete Turner 0:00
Hey everybody Pete a Turner, executive producer and host of your break it down show I've got a hell of a show for you today you are going to be able to say I knew this guy before he really, really made it big. And not that jack cars not already huge because he's a multi time best seller. With his terminal list series of books. His latest book is called savage sun, it just came out. Also it's spread by Ray Porter, who's the basically the number one audible reader so if you're an audible person, one sign up through the break it down show to always get your books either break it down show but three, you are going to love savage sun, I've read the book. I'm going to go back to the beginning and start the series over again. And I'm telling you right now jack is an awesome, awesome author. But before that though, he was also an awesome awesome combat warrior. He was a navy seal. He was a commander in the seal teams. And let me tell you something, he's reached the pinnacle in both professions. So for so you're going to love who jack is. You're going to love how he tells the story. What do you describes and you're going to love what happens next, by the way, this episode is hosted with Scott Husing, who's also a best selling author and myself so you'll get a chance to hear some familiar voices it's always wonderful to share the air with Scott. And now let me tell you what happens for jack so Chris Pratt, yeah that Chris Pratt gets a hold of Jack's work and says I want to start on this and I want to produce it so Jack's work is about to explode even bigger so super, super big recommendations and straight up five stars on savage sent if you like any kind of thriller reading this guy's life has been a thriller and then he's also thought about these stories and since he was a kid, and develop them into full on like a full on universe that he can now produce into a TV series. So highest recommendations we have jack is a great dude. You can see lots of interviews on it, but I think we got something special from him. Because of the way we set everything up. I know you're going to enjoy this episode of the break it down Show. Hey, here's how you can support us. You buy the shirts, which I didn't get done this weekend, but I will get done this week. You can always buy the books through the links that we offer that goes straight to our affiliate account on Amazon. That gives us just a couple of bucks every now and then. The other thing is you can always share you can tell someone about it. If you can do an endorsement to someone face to face looking for podcasts, you gotta listen to the break it down show. They do five shows a week. Hey, by the way, if you're new here, thank you so much if you live abroad, Hey, thank you for listening. If you're, you know, live in another country, and you just love what we do. Hey, thank you. I really dig that we have such a big international presence and I was going to make sure that you all know that I appreciate you. I see your countries lighten up. The UK has been rocking lately. Thank you very, very much. And we're going to be doing more stuff out there. And if you got people from your country that you'd want to have on the show, let me know. Break it down, show calm. I'm absolutely eager to hear from you all. One more quick thing to say save the brave the brave.org do it you know what to do. Alright, Here comes jack Carr. Lions rock productions
Unknown Speaker 3:06
This is Jay Morrison.
Unknown Speaker 3:08
This is Jordan Hussey Dexter from the offspring
Unknown Speaker 3:10
Navy Sebastian yo this is Rick Murat Stewart
Unknown Speaker 3:12
COPPA. This is Mitch Alexis Andy somebody there's a skunk Baxter
Unknown Speaker 3:15
Gabby Reese is Rob bell.
Pete Turner 3:17
This is john Leon Guerrero. Hey, and this is Pete a Turner.
Jack Carr 3:22
Hey, this is author jack car and you're listening to the break it down show.
Pete Turner 3:28
JACK car back in the olden times was a combat warrior, a Navy SEAL who has turned into an author. And so one of the things we do here jack is is we recognize that we all have Letterman jackets, Scott may talk about things combat, I may bring them up, but that's what we used to do. What you do now and have been doing and are still doing is write incredible books. When you were on the teams, Was this something that you were already working on? Or was this a black and white transition from I was on the teams now I'm going on
Jack Carr 4:01
I guess it's a little bit of a Morph because the two things I want to do in life for one serve my country as a seal, and to write fiction in this genre. So I didn't work on it, per se, but I continued reading so I was always a reader from a very young age. My mom was a librarian. So I grew up surrounded by books. And as soon as I could read the things my parents were reading, which was about fifth grade, I started reading Tom Clancy Nelson, Jamil, David Morales, JC Pollock, AJ canal, Mark old and all these guys who had protagonists with backgrounds that I wanted to have in real life one day. So for me, it was just very natural to one want to do that first, and then want to write the same type of books that I was enjoying so much growing up. So during my time in the teens, I continued to read, although I read a lot more nonfiction, at the time on warfare, terrorism, insurgencies, counterinsurgency, that sort of thing, but I always continued to read my favorite authors in the genre. So Vince flans, and Brett Thor's and Daniel Silva's, and Steven hunters and all those novels at the same time, so I was really continued Doing my education. And then, as you guys know, when you when you drop your papers in the military, you go in a different pile. And so for that last year that I was in my job was to essentially get out of this gigantic bureaucracy and get all those appointments and sign all those papers and get those readouts and all that sort of thing. So I had time to start writing. So really, it was that last year that that was the the more portion where I started writing and started leaving the life behind.
scott huesing 5:22
In the transition class, Jack's the guy in the back of the room just scrawling on his computer not listening to the
Unknown Speaker 5:32
the retired
Unknown Speaker 5:33
CEOs like everything. Here's how
scott huesing 5:35
I did. Here's how you build a resume jack.
Unknown Speaker 5:38
Yeah, my goal is to never have a resume or never have a business card. Good for you. forward. So yeah, those classes, everything that I did during that year that had anything to do with the military was pretty much a gigantic waste of time.
Pete Turner 5:51
Yeah, that waste of time was felt by all of us. You know, like, here's how you get a job so you can drive a forklift, like you fucking kidding me. You guys sold me on my face. to click, I'm working at Huachuca, which is like the Intel for all the military. And you gotta got pitching forklift jobs and cop, john, come on.
Unknown Speaker 6:09
Yeah, I just wanted to get out of there. As soon as I dropped those papers, it was dying. I made that transition in my mind. And really before that, you know, I started thinking about it, because I wasn't taking guys downrange my last couple years. In the military, I was my first 1616 and a half years. But then after that, it was really, they have a shore duty here. And I'm at budds as the Operations Officer, there's 800 students, 200 staff. But really, if I don't do anything, that train continues to move, guys are still going to do push ups and sit ups and pull ups and do the runs and swims. And for so for me, that was really where I've made the decision in my mind as I was coming back from my last rack deployment, knowing I was going to go be an operations officer knowing that it was time to take care of my family that made that transition in my mind as far as starting to think about the future and realizing that hey, It's time to pursue this, this other dream that I had from when I was a little kid. And then I dropped those papers, it was really time to get to work.
scott huesing 7:07
And what year was jack?
Unknown Speaker 7:09
That was I came back to Iraq at the end of 2011. And so I'd say spring of 2012 is a really made that decision that it was gonna I was gonna get out at the 20 year mark just had a few more years to go. And it made sense to stay in to give back a little bit one. And then to figure out that transition process, take a breath, and figure out what I was going to do next. You know, I knew what it was it was important to also have some backup plans, some contingency plans, in case something didn't work out. It was good to have backups.
scott huesing 7:44
That's your kind of an anomaly too, because you do 20 years in the in the Navy, Special Forces your Mustang just like me, you're listed then you became an officer. And immediately when you transitioned, you went right into writing and I think a lot of guys They wallow in the the notion of I'm going to contract, I'm going to this GPS position, because that feels comfortable them. Tell. Tell me about your experience, you just totally did a 180 and Dove right into becoming a writer and an entertainer and sharing these awesome stories. So I made that a conscious decision to do
Unknown Speaker 8:21
that. While I was at that position in buds at the SEAL training facility, I saw a lot of people that transitioned out and really couldn't let go of the past life. And they kept wanting to give friends tours of buds or they wanted to go to all these different charity events that lived in the same town I would see the former teammates at school drop off or at the same bars, which also happen to have, you know, pictures of people that didn't make it home on the walls. See, friends at the grocery store, see, wives or friends were deployed. You were just immersed in that culture in that community. And then when they got out, they just kept that more than a foot In past life, and so I recognized that and thought, okay, when when I make this break, I'm gonna make a clean break both physically and psychologically. So we picked up left Coronado, California, and moved to the mountains and wanted to raise our kids up here in a ski town. And at the same time you have used that. That background is it makes me who I am today, as a huge part of who I am today. Hopefully, it makes me a better writer, that their father a better husband, a better citizen, but at the same time, I don't live back there. Move forward, I'm going to continue to write these novels going forward. They're working on the fourth
scott huesing 9:33
deal, for lack of a better word, jack, do you feel some sense of, I don't know. Pity or sadness for guys that can't let go of the past in that, in that sense that they're, they're constantly revisiting the the battle days or the camaraderie that you share in the military, and then they just can't let it go. I mean, do you feel bad for those people? And if I mean, that's the hard way to put it, because I'm not disparaging that because it's important to stay connected. How do you how do you transcend that
Unknown Speaker 10:00
Yeah, no Don't feel bad at all I remember he has a different path. My path just didn't doesn't include the living back there. It includes using that background to move forward, because it is such a big part of me. So I did it for so long did it for 20 years at some very visceral powerful experiences downrange. Very, I feel very fortunate, also that I have all my fingers and toes and emerged relatively unscathed from those experiences, but so don't feel bad. It's just everybody has a different path. And mine happens to be making that clean break and moving forward and moving onward and identifying that next purpose which is taking care of my family, and then following that next passion and that next goal that I had from a very early age which is writing these types of novels, so So yeah, no, I don't think about that too much. It's just everyone has a different way to live and deal with life and, and to live it so
scott huesing 10:53
you do I agree. 100%
Pete Turner 10:55
but let's be honest, though, at your compound up there in the mountains, you still got a hell a pad in case commando happens in real life, like you were still ready to be pulled back.
Jack Carr 11:04
That's that movie was very, very influential in a very early age. So I won't deny that we are prepared in a similar fashion, if anybody comes calling
Pete Turner 11:13
you, by the way because you know we're at with this stuff. Absolutely what I was about to and I didn't know this going in when I was about to go to the army, I was working at Costco and another guy who's in the same situation as me didn't have enough experience had a college degree. We couldn't break through and do anything. He was like dear Tom Clancy books as restocking Tom Clancy books on the shelves and Costco and you know, sure enough Yes, I did. Next thing you know, like literally not even six weeks later, I'm in the army going to go be a spy, you know, so those books have an impact on on the day, guys like us, me, you know, talk.
Unknown Speaker 11:49
Yeah, they certainly influenced me. Yeah. And Funny enough, when I went into the military back then you had to choose what's called a source rating for buds so you're like an MLS, but you Did it before showing up at budds. Because the Navy thought that, hey, 80% of these people are going to wash out of this program. And so let's train them up and whatever they're going to be whatever their specialty is going to be beforehand. And then as soon as they wash out, off, they go to their job, whether whatever that is whether it's machinist made, post was made gunner's mate, whatever that might be. And I chose intelligence. So I went to an intelligence school in Danville, Virginia. And I'll tell you what, everything I sailed through that course, not because of what we learned in the classroom there, but because of all the Tom Clancy novels I had read, growing up, and that is a 100%. True. So I did not have to do very much studying in that 16 week school. I already had that knowledge going up. And interestingly enough, some of the things that get redacted from my house today are things that I learned and read about well before I went into the military, some things in junior high school, so it's a it's pretty ridiculous.
Pete Turner 12:53
Tom Clancy had to fight that court all the time to is like you realize that's in Jane's like already open knowledge So I'm looking at your books right now terminal lists, savage sun and true believer. Talk to us give us an idea. Is it a series? Do you write individual books? How does your universe work?
Unknown Speaker 13:10
Yeah, so the first one, like I wrote down about 5678 different ideas as I started so still in the military did about a one page executive summary on these different ideas. And I chose the one that I thought would be the most primal, the most visceral, the most hard hitting, and the most likely to be picked up by New York publishing house. So that one was the terminal list. And it was kind of up in the air between that one and savage sun, which is the third one, but I knew that I had to develop the characters to get them to a point where I could explore the theme of savage sun so for the first one, revenge without constraint, and I had a little yellow sticky on my computer that had the word revenge on it, and I got that from Steven pressfield. Who, who did the same thing. I think I he did it on the typewriter, but I had it on my little apple here, Steve He's still an old marine. That's right. He'll memory and handle. Yeah, no, of course wrote Legend of Bagger Vance and the Afghan campaign and gets a flyer and then a series of books on creativity of the War of Art, turning pro x wing, just an amazing guy. But I took his advice and put that yellow sticky there so that if either a sentence or a paragraph, chapter or something didn't directly or indirectly lead back to that theme of revenge, that I edited it out, it was gone right away. And that really kept me on track. And I think that's why once he got to New York, there were hardly any edits. There was a couple like one was what we really say this year, what do you think this year and then a third one, I don't remember. But I expected a ton of edits, content and edits, but there were hardly any. And I think that's because I stayed on theme because of Steven pressfield. So that was when I explored first and really, because I I loved books with the theme of revenge. I love movies with the theme of revenge. You know, it seems like people in general Like that theme because things you can't do in real life, you can escape and get them done in the pages of a book or in an hour and a half, two hour movie. I think that goes back to early stories around the campfire, which is why I wanted it to were to stay very primal visceral for that first novel. But more than that, it's also a story of someone who comes back from Iraq and Afghanistan, and takes the tactics, techniques that worked so well against us from the enemy, and brings those to home soil as he unravel the conspiracy, and, and brings those tactics and techniques to the people that wronged him, his team, his family, and then a deeper level of people want to think about it. A little deeper, is about someone who served in Iraq and Afghanistan brings those wars home to the front doors of people who have been sending young men men and women to their deaths for close to 20 years now. So are you Jim Reese, is that you say? Based on better he's a much better shot than I am. But he's a primer as a former seal enlisted sniper who then becomes an officer. So he has a background similar to mine. And I think why, why the book is so powerful is that and why it resonated with New York who sees thousands of these books every year is because the emotions, the feelings that the protagonist feels in the novels are things that I felt at some point down range, so I just took those feelings took those emotions and apply them to a completely fictional narrative. Sure, sure. I think that I mean, you
scott huesing 16:31
you got to write what you know, and that makes the writing easier, more fluid. And you mentioned revenge that that, that emotion of exacting revenge on the bad guy and mean, did you have that in Iraq? Did you exact revenge on those who were protecting you and your your shipmates?
Unknown Speaker 16:52
I don't think I put that much thought into it that there. It was more professional than that, I think. And sure, you know, you get answered Whatever something happens, you lose somebody the the Marines you're working with lose somebody, whatever it is, it wasn't. It was a war. So for me, I don't have to think about that enemy is adapting to us. We're adapting to them, we need to do it faster problems that, for me, added solve that problem said, How do you adapt faster than the enemy? How you disrupt this mail destroy these different networks. So for me, rather than it wasn't personal as far as revenge goes, maybe at the beginning, I had some of those thoughts right after 911 to go back and really search through the memory banks because it's been a while. But really, it was just time to do the job before September 11. It was our job to prepare for war, September 11 came and now it's time to go to war. It was really as simple as that.
scott huesing 17:45
How do you balance that in your head as an artist Now, having to understand the industry of of writing what sells and infusing your own ethics into that because that's interesting because this professional war fighters We are held to a higher standard and and you have to take those experiences and and I talk about that often about the law of war and our code of conduct and everything we're held to to a higher standard that that makes us better that makes America number one in our military. So great. How do you balance that? The ethics.
Unknown Speaker 18:23
I talk to my guys about it a lot. And I thought about that a lot. And I incorporated it into all of our training blocks. So really, we trained up for about 18 months, and we deploy for around six back we do it all again, but didn't want the morals and ethics, that part of it to be one brief that maybe they got from a jag, who came in for a half hour as they're thinking about other things. Maybe everyone's not there, and then they're downrange. And the first time they think about this is when they have someone in flux cuffs who just killed somebody in the platoon. So I needed I knew how important it was to talk about that ahead of time and make that a part of our training, especially as a leader, I thought that was my responsibility. So I often talk about how it is important that we maintain the moral high ground. Because sometimes that's about all that differentiates us from the enemy for us. So once you have someone in Black Ops no matter what they just did, now, as Americans, it's our responsibility to take care of that person, no matter how hard that is. That's just how it goes. You know, your time to put them in the ground is when you enter that room and there, they have that AK that's the time to put them in the ground. If you don't do it, then for some reason, and now they're in custody, well, now they need to be taken back, exploit them for intelligence, interrogate them, and hopefully go out maybe that same night and keep dismantling that network. So but talking about it, and not just assuming that guys are going to understand because they went to sere school because they got one brief from a gym bag. We've never been in that situation and it's just regurgitating some, some copy from a text or from a slide that supposed to, to give that day or presentation. It's it's important as leaders to discuss that ahead of time and make that a part of our training, not just the tactics, techniques and procedures that allows us to go in and crush the enemy.
Pete Turner 20:14
Is that true of your characters? Or because they're from fantasy land, you can make them a little more vindictive, you can make them a little more dangerous, or, you know, you can play with their struggle more openly. I mean, obviously, you guys aren't sitting there, the team's going, I really struggle ethically with what we're doing. I've considered you know, like that this doesn't happen like that.
Unknown Speaker 20:34
No, it's got no, that's why this is Yeah, this is fiction. So this is the, you know, being able to explore that sort of thing in a way that that entertains that takes people on a journey, but you know, just like it with the Tom Clancy novels, or just like I did with those other novels from David Morel and Nelson Demille. Growing up I learned a ton from reading those novels, even though they were fiction. And it also helps instill in me a love of reading. Not just fiction, but but nonfiction in the story. affection, all of that. And I think that makes me a big part of who I am today. So, so if yes, I do get to explore that through through these fictional characters and fictional scenarios, although there's enough realism in there that keeps it keeps it authentic. So that's why I wanted to take away absolutely everything cuz I remember growing up the voiceover in those movies, I used to live that way, say, you know, he had nothing left to lose. And I was like, well, he could die, he could always die. So I wanted to really go back to that old that the Shuto how Samurai would go into into battle in ancient Japan, thinking they were already dead, because that made them more effective and efficient lawyers. So I thought how do you do that today? How do you do that to a modern lawyer? How do you take away everything and then put him into combat thinking he is already dead? And that's the conspiracy I came up with that I got really God from the church hearings that took place in the 70s that expose a lot of overreach let's say by certain government agencies, CIA a particular like what what what kind of time has passed since the church hearings where somebody didn't get the memo. And they've gone back and are now testing out a drug on our nation's most elite lawyers that have some side effects. And that's really what kicks off the premise and the conspiracy in the first novel, The term analysts, so it's, it gets answered, the question is, yeah, you get to explore all that, through the medium of a fictional thriller, which is a blast from it
Pete Turner 22:21
strikes me as funny, you know, like, all three of us have seen a lot of time in combat zone. So when you get briefed by a jag on how to be risk adverse and avoid, avoid that, you know, dangerous things like, but you realize, like, all we do our dangerous things, like you're asking us to put this totally unrealistic lens on what's happening. And by the way, our peers across the street from us are not doing the same thing and we've got to adapt to you know, that environment is that it struck me as funny and, you know, Scott, I'm sure it has something to say about that. But like that Scott talks about the friction, of combat and and those things Like I think of friction in terms of logistics, like how many times in Iraq that I sit in a chair, and have it just completely shatter underneath me or I go up to a door and the door no longer opens and I'm like, Fuck, now I've got to spend 45 minutes trying to unfuck this door, so I can go into my office or whatever it is, right? Like, all of these things. Does any of that stuff leak into your books at all?
Unknown Speaker 23:20
Oh, yeah. Not on that level. Not on the I would say the administrative tactical level, but more on the strategic level decisions that are made by people sitting in comfortable chairs back in Washington or in Northern Virginia. So that that definitely creeps in more than creeps in with senior level military leaders and politicians in particular. So you get to I get to take some of those those emotions. And I guess that comes from if we had made the same type of decisions tactically, that our senior level leaders made strategically, we would have been court martialed, thrown out of the military, but senior level military leaders, senior level politicians, make these Some atrocious strategic level decision and you just continue on stay in office and get promoted. You mean like download
scott huesing 24:07
a secret that that's what I love to supernet on a hard drive and then just pain and and off to the penny officers like this for me
Jack Carr 24:14
it's a it's it's great for I guess it's very therapeutic I should say that I get to explore those things through the medium of a
scott huesing 24:22
connection. That's gotta be Yeah, that's gonna be liberating. Do you use the the, this genre this medium to, to really purge all that stuff that people want to say and you don't have any, I guess repercussions because when you write nonfiction, everyone often asked, Did you send this to department defense gate clerks? I'm like, No, I didn't because I wasn't given any way trade secrets or anything confidential but a lot of guys have to go through that process. You don't because it's fiction. And I think that that opens yourself up a little bit. Talk to me about the critics when they read your stuff. On accuracy and using that as kind of, especially the politics, man, because you're all over Twitter too. And you know, you don't dabble too much in the politics. But how do you deal with the critics?
Unknown Speaker 25:11
Yeah, it's interesting, because this is a whole new thing for me. So I'm really just three years into this. And before I started down this path, I didn't have a Facebook account. Back in the early days, I didn't have a MySpace account, didn't have Instagram, Twitter didn't want any of those sorts of things, and just saw them as nothing good could have come from those had I had any of those accounts while in the military. Now it's a little different. Now. That's weird. Now you're the outlier coming in if you don't have that, electronic history, but that's, that's another discussion altogether. So delving into this what has been an education and just like on the battlefield, I look at these things as as opportunities that weren't there. 20 years ago, 30 years ago for authors, just like this podcast wasn't around 30 years ago, 20 years ago. For an author to do to reach an audience or help build a readership, but part of that is now you are much more accessible. And especially if you're here, just like you're building any business and you're out there, and you make a comment here, or you post something there, you are now open to every single person that has a cell phone or a computer, and they can all let you know exactly how they feel about whatever you posted, or whatever you wrote in your novel, and there's no filter, there's no editorial board. There's no in the 60s 70s 80s 90s so everybody gets there gets their say, so I don't spend too much time dwelling on it and the way I look at negative reviews, or the people that are super critical tactic crazy is that hey, you know what they're doing, they're just selling a book to a person that's gonna like it for the exact reason that this person does. So when I see that person writing something about too violent To political to right wing or whatever it may be, Okay, you know what, this is just selling it to the person that's looking for that exact thing. So surely you crazy person on Amazon review or Goodreads or wherever you are. So I look at it like that I try to put that that little positive type spin on it so, so that I don't go crazy and I don't respond to
scott huesing 27:19
it as a as a guy that learned more about social media at age 46. When I started into this realm, the one rule I set for myself is don't ever respond to the crazy because once you start drinking the poison, it's, it's, it's gonna kill you and you just cannot do that. I think that you're probably you're probably inundated with a tea you got a big readership The books are hugely popular. And you do have to deal with that. I mean, do you if you manage your own social media?
Unknown Speaker 27:50
Yeah, yeah. About that stage where I'm gonna maybe need some help here soon or something, but it's, I try to respond to everyone. Thank you. Every one because I'm sincerely appreciative that, that the people are reading the novels telling their friends about it. And really, it's modern day word of mouth. So the way I look at social media is that hey, that's my storefront. Just like if I owned a general store in small town America, and someone came in and I behind the counter, and they asked me, Hey, where can I get some cereal? Absolutely. A man said, Hey, I'm looking for directions to the Interstate, whatever it is, and I'm gonna treat them the same way people on social media the same way I would if I was behind that counter in my general store. So that's the way I look when I look at it. And same thing if someone crazy comes in, you know, you're gonna want to escort them out as soon as possible, which is the block feature on social media, which I am a huge fan of. So really, anything negative, anything crazy block, you're done. So that's kind of the way the way I look at it and deal with it. And I try not to I try. I don't go down any rabbit holes because I don't have time. When someone wants to engage on something political or some sort of issue like there's just there's just not time that they For me to do that, and that's not, that's not what I do. So I just maybe give a little heart and move on. Or if it's crazy, then you blocked. But really, it's, it's really just a way for me to thank people and also offer something of value. So that's why I'm not just promoting myself on social media, don't use it just as an advertising platform. Use it as a way to engage and offer hopefully something of value to people that go to that page and learn a little bit about history, terrorist events. learn a little bit more about me get behind the curtain, and maybe inspire people with a little bit of my journey and show that it's possible and don't pay attention to the odds make the life you want to get out there and get after it. So that's, uh, that's kind of how I look at social media.
Pete Turner 29:41
Speaking of social media and podcasts that didn't exist there two years ago, you are on a podcast, you can talk to 80 different countries right now where we have active listeners, tell them why they want to go out and buy your book. Here's your chance to elevator pitch. I don't know thousands of people. 10s of thousands have been
Unknown Speaker 29:56
nice. I love it. So much. That's a tough one. Because because I just do the job, and I'm not really I'm not when I market or when I talk about it, I'm not really, you know, selling, I guess I'm selling my book, but it's kind of a secondary, it's kind of, in addition to whatever value hopefully I'm offering. But these are novels where they feel real. They're a complete fiction, and you go on a journey, just like you would in any movie, or any book in the genre, those emotions and those feelings that the protagonist feels are real. I didn't interview someone who was in Special Operations, and then think about how they would feel about doing something. No, that's how I felt doing those things. And that's how the that comes across in the novel. And that's why I think that's why they're, they're doing so well. So if you want that kind of a journey, and when I get a little bit of a peek into the mind of a special operations lawyer in the through the medium of political thriller, then pick these up. And I'd suggest starting with the first one because it's there, continue and they're all part of the journey for a character. The second one A true believer. It's really a novel of redemption. And it's about someone who goes on a transformative journey, just like we all do when we leave the military. So I tap into those feelings. What does it feel like to leave that and move on to something else, because that's what the character has to do. In the second novel, he has to learn how to live again, find his next purpose, find his next mission. And then the third one is the savage son. And that's where we explore the dark side of man through the through the hunter hunted dynamic. And that was inspired by the most dangerous game that I read back in sixth grade. So back then even sixth grade, I knew that one day I'd write a modern thriller that paid tribute to that classic tale. So savage son is that book
Pete Turner 31:40
is the most dangerous game. Is that the ICT version? Or is it
Unknown Speaker 31:44
nice? I like that you knew that. You know, it's a bit goes back to my original to the original Richard Connell. 1924 short story. And yeah. So anybody that knows that, that story should should get a kick out of savage son.
Pete Turner 31:58
Hey, this is Pete. Turner from lions rock productions, we create podcasts around here. And if you your brand or your company want to figure out how to do a podcast, just talk to me, I'll give you the advice on the right gear, the best plan to show you how to take a podcast that makes sense for you that's sustainable. That's scalable and fun. Hit me up at Pete at breakdown, show calm, let me help. I want to hear about that. So anybody that knows that that story should should get a kick out of savage son. When you start a new career like this, there's the dream of what it is. And obviously, the reality is going to be different. But what are some of the things you're like, you know, I love writing, but I really don't have a lot of time for x, or I really didn't realize this was gonna be so hard. Like, for example, if you get to, I think it's 2500 reviews in your book, it'll make money for the rest of your life. It'll constantly so it'll never stop. But But whoever thought about vacuum No, I'm trying to write a good book. What are some of those things you've picked up? You're like, you know, this is part of the business and it's not always pretty, but I sure wish I could replace this with something else.
Jack Carr 32:59
While I did not know that about the 2500, so thank you for passing that along. And I don't think that
Unknown Speaker 33:05
the interesting, no.
scott huesing 33:08
He's way smarter than me. Everyone has
Unknown Speaker 33:10
no idea. But so for me it was I didn't know that there was a business side of this. And all I thought, as I got ready to get out of the military and started doing this, and then even when that gave it to New York, and I didn't even know I needed an agent. I'm glad I didn't, because I might not have these books out today, had I known that I didn't know there was a business side to this, I thought you just wrote and you can live it up cabin in the mountains and send it to New York. And I thought, okay, there's some edits to go back and forth. But that's it. I did not know that you everything you have to do as an author, the same things you'd have to do if you were starting any business. So all the marketing and the branding and the CO branding and the advertising, social media, the engagement budgets, everything you have to do as an author, but really, you're building, it's a startup, and it's just like you would start a startup or anything in your garage. I did not know that that was the case. I mean, a few months out, I was like, I guess I need a website. So I guess I should have one of those. And I guess I'm gonna have to do some social media. So if you go to the bottom of my Instagram, you'll see there's, like, no pictures of me. And then I, you can kind of trace my progression, and then I discover filters. And then I like put a picture of me, like from my back there, you can see my backpack and like the side of a little bit of the side of my head, and then it kind of goes and you can see the progression, if you go to the bottom and work your way up. But it was, it was, I guess, a shock that it wasn't just writing and then sending a manuscript in New York, it was all these other things. But for me, as soon as I realized that, then I looked at them and say, these are all opportunities. And these are all opportunities that other authors that started up in the 70s and 80s did not have, and I have them today. So how do I take advantage of this momentum? How do I take advantage of these emerging opportunities just like I would on the battlefield, and how do I offer people something of value, and that's really what it was was all about. So I've constantly learning and constantly adapting just like I would on the battlefield. And that's how I look at it. Although the repercussions from doing something making a bad decision are a lot less dire, and that my guys aren't going to be coming home in inboxes. And that's, so for me, that's, I can solve those problems on the written page, and I can figure out those problems. Not necessary, I don't have to do them in real time on the battlefield with bullets flying. As far as the business side of this, I can take a breath, I can think about things and then make the best decision as I move forward.
scott huesing 35:33
That's a great message that's constantly reinforced on every episode that we've had any type of veteran artist on as you could write a best seller in your basement or in their cabin in the woods. But if you're not willing to turn the hat around, and become a businessman, marketing promotion, because Simon and Schuster is only going to be so much big publishing houses only gonna do so much if you're not willing to give of yourself. You're going to be one of those guys that says, boy Why isn't my story doing well? Why am I not selling these books because it's not just putting fingers on the keyboard and then sending it to your editor. There's so much more. And you just nailed that. And it's a great message for any veteran, especially any writer that wants to share a story because veterans don't own great stories. Were just a part of it. So to hear that time and again, is really powerful. It's inspiring, for the best word I could find. And you're doing that. Let's talk about your involvement now with the terminal list and Chris Pratt, let's let's talk about that. Yes, that's right. And that's, that's some good stuff. Can we talk about that?
Unknown Speaker 36:43
Absolutely. I couldn't talk about it until now. But now that they've, they've announced it. I can talk about it. Yeah, Chris. optioned it before it even came out. So before it's a it hits shelves in March of 2018, is when it came out on the publication date. Before then he optioned it. And the crazy part of this is as I was writing, I thought of Not, not who my character would be, but who could play my character who would be the best person to play James Reese. And it's so crazy because as I'm writing this Chris is doing Parks and Rec in a very small part in Zero Dark 30, which is probably what I guess subliminally in my head made me think of him as the person, the one person I thought about to play James Reese, as I was writing, which is so crazy, and to have that happen, and I also thought of that one director, I thought of directing. This was anti Foucault. Hmm. So out of both those people and now they're the two people that are involved in making this happen. So it's just yeah, crazy story how how all that came about, but I feel so fortunate and you can still derail so I'll give you my expectations very low so I can do,
scott huesing 37:54
Chris Pratt can grow a good beard, which is essential for playing your character because you can go Got no beard. I don't know if James Reese does but yeah, I don't know if James Reese goes beard no beard but Yeah, you do. I like that. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 38:06
It is amazing guys such such a great guy we've spent so we spent a little time together here last year. Yeah, there's I could not think there's a lot of trust because we had had three different options on the table. And I chose Korea there was no question. I was going to choose Chris because it's a lot of trust involved. And for me, thinking about him playing this character as I was writing it, and then having it come to fruition and him wanting it before it even came out before anybody even knew that I existed, or this book existed. It was just Hey, the stars are aligning here. And this makes sense. And even if it doesn't happen is the right decision.
scott huesing 38:42
Was your was your decision based in any part by the fact that Chris has been very vocal in Hollywood about support for the military, and which lends itself to being more conservative in a lot of regards.
Unknown Speaker 38:56
I mean, it would have had I needed to factor that in but I did need to factor that in at all? It was more of the Hey, I thought of this person playing this role. Now he wants it there's no way that I should go with anyone else. Don't get greedy. So, so I went with with Chris, of course has always been, yeah, but no, it does certainly help that he does have a mindset similar to mine in a lot of respects. And I think that he's at that stage in his, in his career where just like, like Tom Hanks in the 80s we all grew up with him, you know, Joe versus Yeah, or, or us or whatever else and then all of a sudden now he exactly and then all of a sudden he does. He has Philadelphia and you know total one ad for him as an actor. And now and from then on he could choose his any role he wanted just shows the versatility, took a risk, and it worked out and that really gave him the options and opportunities to do what he's done says and I thought you know what, Chris is amazing, amazing guy. He's obviously has, he's at that stage where he needs to do something like that as well do something that's a little darker, that shows his range as an actor. So the more more physical and, and this is, this is that role. And you recognize that as well. And he chose that I feel very honored that he's chosen this story to be that role for him. So yeah, fingers crossed. And I, I've been working on the script for the last month or so as an advisor to the screenwriter, who's an amazing guy, and I could not be more happy with what they've done with that. It's so cool. And it's so it's so educational for me to see this process and see how they do it, how it evolves. And so for me, I've just been so thankful to be here.
Pete Turner 40:43
I want to make sure I make this comment so we don't get too far past it. I'm wondering when someone is going to discover that Tom Hanks did a movie as a cross dressing, you know, like, like Bosom Buddies couldn't be made today. Like it would be too offensive for everybody. And it's like they have no idea. Did it You know and so when they discover this although the world's gonna end but just to comment for the audience to enjoy but the question I want to ask you about this is how one so look you're just some dumb seal on the team's How the hell does Chris Pratt find your book?
Unknown Speaker 41:15
Yeah, so that's that's a great story to see how do I go about talking about this because I want to make sure that I talk to all the people involved and make sure I get there go ahead but I got a call out of the blue in the fall of 2017. So before the books come out from an old buddy from the teams and I hadn't talked to him in five years or so and great guy and he calls me in and says in so this is gonna be about the gala gala came out. I don't even know what a galley was until right about this time. And so a galley copy is a is a pre release of a novel. It's in like a paperback type form. It's still a rough draft. For all practical purposes, that comes out and goes to reviewers and influencers ahead of publication dates so they can get blurbs. Other authors you blurb reviewers. do reviews Ready to go? That sort of thing? So I had those my friend calls and, and says, Hey, you know, do you remember me? I'm like, of course, how's it going? And he says, Well, you know, I was wondering, thank you for what you did for me in the seal teams. And I was like, oh, man, what did I get him out of jail? And I, you know, go into the memory banks of all the variances. I had over 20 years and the teams with everybody, you know, it was very simple thing. And we sat down in my office, he was getting ready to get out. And we talked about transition. And we introduced him to a couple people in the private sector. And just like I would do for, for any good guy leaving the seal teams, or somebody who's staying in the seal teams that just needs a little advice on their path. But anyway, it's a that made an impact with him. And he wanted to call and say thank you, and I was like, absolutely, man, it's my pleasure. And he said, I already have a book coming out. And I said, Yeah, I got a book coming out. It's a come out in a few months. So these galley copy things. If you want to take a look at it, I'd love to send you one and he said, You I'd be grateful to check it out. But I'd also like to give one to a friend of mine. And I'm like, Oh, yeah, no problem is that. And this is Chris Pratt. Like, Oh, that's interesting, because that's the one person I thought it was. I was writing novels playing this character. So anyway, that's how that came about, and sent it off. And Chris read it and loved it. And next thing, you know, he's optioned it. So it's a very, very cool both those guys are are just outstanding human beings in general. And if Chris wasn't an actor, you know, we'd be doing things together, regardless because he's such a such a great guy. And yeah, I feel very fortunate that things are are on this path. But once again, want to keep expectations low thanks and go off the rails in Hollywood at anytime, so don't want to be disappointed if it if it doesn't happen. So I gotta manage those expectations as well. Just feel fortunate that it's as far as it is.
Pete Turner 43:50
And are you adapting the screenplay yourself or someone else or adapting the book into a screenplay for you
Unknown Speaker 43:55
know, David Giulio, who's an awesome guy, he's the showrunner screenwriter. I'm just assisting mostly in the technical side of things, and really just learning. Yeah, I wanted them to have I want them to the best of the professionals kind of like people ask me, Hey, did you read your audiobook? No, I want the best guy out there reading my audio book. And that's Ray Porter, who's amazing. And he has a huge following way people follow him from a like they do with all these top narrators follow them from project to project rather than author to author of all audio books, they'll follow a narrator to different projects. I didn't really know that. But yeah, I want the best narrator out there doing the audio book. I want the best screenwriter out there adapting it for film. And so I'm just assisting in and learning which is really cool. But uh, yeah, it's it's fantastic. I couldn't be more excited about the team they put together for this
scott huesing 44:44
now. That's great, man. Does anyone ever ask you the question? Why don't you read your own book?
Unknown Speaker 44:49
Yeah, yeah, I get that a lot. Got a lot and has that same answer. You know what the best guy out there reading it. And I didn't really think about how people follow narrators wrote different projects at all. I realized that way after I chose re border, and I just chose reporter because Simon and Schuster called me one afternoon and said, Hey, who do you want to read your audiobook? And I was like, I don't know, because I'm really, I'm a reader, I read guide, I need that physical book there. So I'm not really an audio book person. And they will just let us know, by the end of the day, it was like two in the afternoon, you know, like, like, give me like an hour New York time, as I started listening to the samples and all these different books, and just like sample sample sample, and then I listened to Ray and I was like, Oh, that's good. And I was a bunch of his other ones samples from other things that he's done. And this is the guy and luckily, he had this huge following. I had no idea. And then it got nominated for best audio book of the year last year, which was great. So we got to go to New York and put on the taxes and hang out in person together. And he's just a fantastic guy, as well. And it was so cool to see it up there next to Stephen King and next to Ruth were Ruth were one, but it was just so So cool to see it up there with all those people that that have been writing for so long and are just fans such fantastic authors. So, yeah, very cool. But I think if I did ever did some sort of a nonfiction type deal, and it wouldn't be, you know, an autobiography of what I did in the teams or anything, there's some other ideas I have in that realm. But if I did something there, then I would probably read that one myself.
scott huesing 46:22
And that's something they don't tell you. I didn't. I wish I would have gotten that information two years ago as well there three years ago when we were developing it, but I think you're one of the rare exceptions to I was in New York doing a, I think, a Veterans Day event and I reached out to Dave and ran into red echo in Ramadi. And one striking fact came up at dinner. He said, You're the first author I've ever met, because we're so dispersed, but I thought that was rare but to get to meet the guy that reads you.
Unknown Speaker 46:52
That's pretty cool. So cool. Yeah. And if you if we didn't do meet up in New York out of flown out to LA and would have a beer out there. But yeah, it's I think it's important to have that personal connection, especially if it's somebody that's a great guy like I just lucked out that Ray happens to be a great guy. If he wasn't to be a different story, I don't know what I do. I get to be selling books, I'd stick with it. But he just happens to be an amazing person. And we get along great. And he's just, yeah, it's super fun to work with people that are cool that you're friends with. You know, it's, I feel very fortunate in that respect. Across the board, everybody. Simon Schuster is amazing. my publicist is amazing. My editor publisher, Emily besler, she's a she published in school and continues to publish in with the Kyle Mills, novels, polishes, adore this all this entire team. I just could not be more fortunate to have so many great people working on this with me,
Pete Turner 47:46
Hey, tell us what's next. I mean, obviously, you're writing more books, but what's out there on the horizon? Obviously, you have the Chris Pratt project, and that's cool. But like you said, you know, temporary expectations, what but what's out there, it's in your control that we can expect from you.
Unknown Speaker 47:58
Yep. So it's booked For his work now I finished the final edits to book three to savage son just a couple nights ago. Because I go back and forth a few times, and then people start fighting. When these galleys come out, people start noticing little, little mistakes here and there mostly grammar that they haven't been taught up to that point. It's amazing how the human brain works. I mean, you've read a sentence thousands of times, and you know what should be there. So your brain puts it there. But it's not really there. Someone else catches it, it's reading it for the first time when and that shouldn't be an A, or should be an and, but your mind is just thrown the D in there, take him out the end, because that's how the sense should read. It's incredible. It's always fascinating to me. So I finished that just a couple nights ago. And that means that after this podcast, I go 100% full force into book four. I'm super excited about it. It's all outlined. I've started it, and now it's just continuing to look for those emerging opportunities and solve those problems on the page which is what I love because in the outline section This holds true for the first novel through the third and end of the fourth. If I ran into a problem in that outline, I didn't get discouraged. I didn't say I didn't stop and wait until I figured out that problem until I moved on. I just went over it, I put a little question mark put a little x and continued to move forward. Because I knew that I had time, I had time to go back on the battlefield, I didn't hear I do. So I'm confident that in the year that it takes to do these, I will figure out and that problem as I work through this novel, and then I go back to it later. And that really helps keep things moving forward. So that's what will be happening here in the next weeks and months. Is that all those things that I skipped over in book four, because I didn't have the answer right there. But I didn't want it to hold me up. Well, those will start getting solved as I immerse myself deeper and deeper into the plot into the characters into the theme as I continue to push forward. So that's really the focus of the next few months and then paperback book of truth. lever that comes out February 25. So I have a bunch of bunch of things that are coming out for this content wise around that. And then April 14 is savage son. So there'll be a build up to that as well with a different content and a book tour, all that sort of thing, a book festival in Florida. So there's all these little one offs here and there that keeps me busy, that are part of the business side of this, that are not just the writing side of this. So really figuring out that, that balance and you know, sometimes it swings all the way to the business side, and then sometimes it swings all the way back to the to the writing side. And sometimes it's in the middle going back and forth. So it's, you got to get it all. You got to get it all. It's all it's all part. That's all part of being a professional writer professional. You've got it all that's on your website in addition to you get geared merchandise and you know, our friend, Eli crane bottle breacher there's some cool stuff there and you also support multiple charities through offering those pieces of merchandise up in the books. Never So just tell everybody where where to go where to find jack. So official jack car.com is the website and for people that want a little more deep dive into some of the weapons or what I use in the books, what I used in the military, there's that informations out there on the blog on the website, so they can check all that out. And then there's a link to jack Carr usa.com, which is the merchandise and really, I didn't want to just, you know, get a few followers or people or whatever and throw a hat or a T shirt up and try to make some money off it. I went didn't that didn't really sit right with me. So but I still want to but people have asked me about it, and I wanted to
Unknown Speaker 51:37
do something. And so what I did was I figured out a few different things that are personal to me, like bottle breacher. I had that connection to Eli. There's a really cool bookmark made out of copper. They're all handmade and have a 556 shell that hangs off the end. I went to mark your place in a novel. That's a veteran owned business. So there's a few things up there on the website. jack Carr USA, but all the profits go to veteran focused foundations and those are highlighted on the side as well. And there are veteran foundations that have a personal connection to so they didn't just pick one out of a hat that sounded cool or had a cool website or something like that. I have a personal connection to each and every one of those veteran focus foundations and those are explained and highlighted on that webpage. So that's out there and then on the social media front it's jet car at jet car USA, on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter. But three was too many three was one of my going to So Facebook just repost from Instagram so people at Facebook don't get get mad because it's not you know, I'm not responding to anything. It just happens to repost there. So there is a Facebook page but I try to get back to each and every person on Instagram and Twitter. And you can sign up for the for my newsletter as well and every month I have a reading list that comes out six books from my reading list will be highlighted Each month I've been doing that since October, in the series readers like that, because I give a little paragraph or two on why each book was impactful to me at a certain stage in my life, either as a writer or as a military professional and why. So that's, that's out there as well. So, so I'm out there active in those spaces. And I really do appreciate everybody that reaches out, because they're the reason that I can I can do this and that I've been able to transition into this next stage of my life and I really appreciate all the the word of mouth that has made this a success because I didn't come from a background in politics or sports or have a following from something. It was from nothing. And it was the word of mouth from readers that made this book or these books now. Such a success, so be forever grateful for that. I love it.
Pete Turner 53:53
I love it. Now you got to read Scott's book and and do the big recommendation
Unknown Speaker 53:57
I had right here. I have it right here. Absolutely. Yep, we got we got to meet that at shacho and hang out for a bit. So yeah, I'm looking forward to the Ross Minsky. Yep. Yeah, yep. What a great guy. So
Unknown Speaker 54:10
Ross
Unknown Speaker 54:12
Yep, I'll see him in the door then you knocked in April. We're gonna do a little thing of the shooting range out there as part of the tour in Colorado. So looking forward to seeing him out there.
Pete Turner 54:23
Thanks for coming on the show man. I appreciate it. You're always welcome to come back on and I know people will dig your books because they are audience one of the things you know you don't get to pick what happens but audience likes to buy books and read them and I get feedback all the time on positive things. Just the other day one of people from the audience was reading Scott's book all the way the other side of the world other hemisphere another day of the of the week. You know where they live? It's so far away. But there she is reading Scott's book. So these these things move and I appreciate it and everybody who buys the book, do go on to Amazon rate and review it. You have to do that because it's that's money for an author
Unknown Speaker 55:00
You know what I didn't really realize that at all like I didn't do any research into this space other than just dive in but they do help and what I also encourage people to do since we're talking about it is to go to their favorite books and read the bad reviews on their favorite books because you'll see like how crazy it can be and how someone will say get like a one star book coming with a torn cover from Amazon of course has nothing to do with what's in the book Yeah. Or but it's still it drags down
scott huesing 55:28
yeah but and you also hear if you don't know this also click on the reviewers profile and see what else they reviewed if they reviewed 50 books or they reviewed one book give it a one star review and also they have like this egg beater and exercise machine and diapers hilarious.
Unknown Speaker 55:42
Yeah, it's you
scott huesing 55:43
know, it's it's kind of skewed man, but I can't like dude.
Unknown Speaker 55:50
But the point being is that to counter those crazy ones on your favorite book, go to your favorite author or whatever else than that it's important to leave leave one and leave again. counter some of that craziness because yeah, you're right the person that reviews you know 13 egg beaters and then all of a sudden they were given a one star review because it came with a corn corn cover or because it's to right wing or whatever it may be.
scott huesing 56:15
Well, you can count on some fire support from from me Pete in a I just want to say thanks, man and keep keep up the fire brother. We're proud of you and, you know, love what you're doing out there.
Semper Fi. Thanks so much for the support. sincerely appreciate it and hopefully we'll meet up again in person soon.
Hey everybody Pete a Turner, executive producer and host of your break it down show I've got a hell of a show for you today you are going to be able to say I knew this guy before he really, really made it big. And not that jack cars not already huge because he's a multi time best seller. With his terminal list series of books. His latest book is called savage sun, it just came out. Also it's spread by Ray Porter, who's the basically the number one audible reader so if you're an audible person, one sign up through the break it down show to always get your books either break it down show but three, you are going to love savage sun, I've read the book. I'm going to go back to the beginning and start the series over again. And I'm telling you right now jack is an awesome, awesome author. But before that though, he was also an awesome awesome combat warrior. He was a navy seal. He was a commander in the seal teams. And let me tell you something, he's reached the pinnacle in both professions. So for so you're going to love who jack is. You're going to love how he tells the story. What do you describes and you're going to love what happens next, by the way, this episode is hosted with Scott Husing, who's also a best selling author and myself so you'll get a chance to hear some familiar voices it's always wonderful to share the air with Scott. And now let me tell you what happens for jack so Chris Pratt, yeah that Chris Pratt gets a hold of Jack's work and says I want to start on this and I want to produce it so Jack's work is about to explode even bigger so super, super big recommendations and straight up five stars on savage sent if you like any kind of thriller reading this guy's life has been a thriller and then he's also thought about these stories and since he was a kid, and develop them into full on like a full on universe that he can now produce into a TV series. So highest recommendations we have jack is a great dude. You can see lots of interviews on it, but I think we got something special from him. Because of the way we set everything up. I know you're going to enjoy this episode of the break it down Show. Hey, here's how you can support us. You buy the shirts, which I didn't get done this weekend, but I will get done this week. You can always buy the books through the links that we offer that goes straight to our affiliate account on Amazon. That gives us just a couple of bucks every now and then. The other thing is you can always share you can tell someone about it. If you can do an endorsement to someone face to face looking for podcasts, you gotta listen to the break it down show. They do five shows a week. Hey, by the way, if you're new here, thank you so much if you live abroad, Hey, thank you for listening. If you're, you know, live in another country, and you just love what we do. Hey, thank you. I really dig that we have such a big international presence and I was going to make sure that you all know that I appreciate you. I see your countries lighten up. The UK has been rocking lately. Thank you very, very much. And we're going to be doing more stuff out there. And if you got people from your country that you'd want to have on the show, let me know. Break it down, show calm. I'm absolutely eager to hear from you all. One more quick thing to say save the brave the brave.org do it you know what to do. Alright, Here comes jack Carr. Lions rock productions
Unknown Speaker 3:06
This is Jay Morrison.
Unknown Speaker 3:08
This is Jordan Hussey Dexter from the offspring
Unknown Speaker 3:10
Navy Sebastian yo this is Rick Murat Stewart
Unknown Speaker 3:12
COPPA. This is Mitch Alexis Andy somebody there's a skunk Baxter
Unknown Speaker 3:15
Gabby Reese is Rob bell.
Pete Turner 3:17
This is john Leon Guerrero. Hey, and this is Pete a Turner.
Jack Carr 3:22
Hey, this is author jack car and you're listening to the break it down show.
Pete Turner 3:28
JACK car back in the olden times was a combat warrior, a Navy SEAL who has turned into an author. And so one of the things we do here jack is is we recognize that we all have Letterman jackets, Scott may talk about things combat, I may bring them up, but that's what we used to do. What you do now and have been doing and are still doing is write incredible books. When you were on the teams, Was this something that you were already working on? Or was this a black and white transition from I was on the teams now I'm going on
Jack Carr 4:01
I guess it's a little bit of a Morph because the two things I want to do in life for one serve my country as a seal, and to write fiction in this genre. So I didn't work on it, per se, but I continued reading so I was always a reader from a very young age. My mom was a librarian. So I grew up surrounded by books. And as soon as I could read the things my parents were reading, which was about fifth grade, I started reading Tom Clancy Nelson, Jamil, David Morales, JC Pollock, AJ canal, Mark old and all these guys who had protagonists with backgrounds that I wanted to have in real life one day. So for me, it was just very natural to one want to do that first, and then want to write the same type of books that I was enjoying so much growing up. So during my time in the teens, I continued to read, although I read a lot more nonfiction, at the time on warfare, terrorism, insurgencies, counterinsurgency, that sort of thing, but I always continued to read my favorite authors in the genre. So Vince flans, and Brett Thor's and Daniel Silva's, and Steven hunters and all those novels at the same time, so I was really continued Doing my education. And then, as you guys know, when you when you drop your papers in the military, you go in a different pile. And so for that last year that I was in my job was to essentially get out of this gigantic bureaucracy and get all those appointments and sign all those papers and get those readouts and all that sort of thing. So I had time to start writing. So really, it was that last year that that was the the more portion where I started writing and started leaving the life behind.
scott huesing 5:22
In the transition class, Jack's the guy in the back of the room just scrawling on his computer not listening to the
Unknown Speaker 5:32
the retired
Unknown Speaker 5:33
CEOs like everything. Here's how
scott huesing 5:35
I did. Here's how you build a resume jack.
Unknown Speaker 5:38
Yeah, my goal is to never have a resume or never have a business card. Good for you. forward. So yeah, those classes, everything that I did during that year that had anything to do with the military was pretty much a gigantic waste of time.
Pete Turner 5:51
Yeah, that waste of time was felt by all of us. You know, like, here's how you get a job so you can drive a forklift, like you fucking kidding me. You guys sold me on my face. to click, I'm working at Huachuca, which is like the Intel for all the military. And you gotta got pitching forklift jobs and cop, john, come on.
Unknown Speaker 6:09
Yeah, I just wanted to get out of there. As soon as I dropped those papers, it was dying. I made that transition in my mind. And really before that, you know, I started thinking about it, because I wasn't taking guys downrange my last couple years. In the military, I was my first 1616 and a half years. But then after that, it was really, they have a shore duty here. And I'm at budds as the Operations Officer, there's 800 students, 200 staff. But really, if I don't do anything, that train continues to move, guys are still going to do push ups and sit ups and pull ups and do the runs and swims. And for so for me, that was really where I've made the decision in my mind as I was coming back from my last rack deployment, knowing I was going to go be an operations officer knowing that it was time to take care of my family that made that transition in my mind as far as starting to think about the future and realizing that hey, It's time to pursue this, this other dream that I had from when I was a little kid. And then I dropped those papers, it was really time to get to work.
scott huesing 7:07
And what year was jack?
Unknown Speaker 7:09
That was I came back to Iraq at the end of 2011. And so I'd say spring of 2012 is a really made that decision that it was gonna I was gonna get out at the 20 year mark just had a few more years to go. And it made sense to stay in to give back a little bit one. And then to figure out that transition process, take a breath, and figure out what I was going to do next. You know, I knew what it was it was important to also have some backup plans, some contingency plans, in case something didn't work out. It was good to have backups.
scott huesing 7:44
That's your kind of an anomaly too, because you do 20 years in the in the Navy, Special Forces your Mustang just like me, you're listed then you became an officer. And immediately when you transitioned, you went right into writing and I think a lot of guys They wallow in the the notion of I'm going to contract, I'm going to this GPS position, because that feels comfortable them. Tell. Tell me about your experience, you just totally did a 180 and Dove right into becoming a writer and an entertainer and sharing these awesome stories. So I made that a conscious decision to do
Unknown Speaker 8:21
that. While I was at that position in buds at the SEAL training facility, I saw a lot of people that transitioned out and really couldn't let go of the past life. And they kept wanting to give friends tours of buds or they wanted to go to all these different charity events that lived in the same town I would see the former teammates at school drop off or at the same bars, which also happen to have, you know, pictures of people that didn't make it home on the walls. See, friends at the grocery store, see, wives or friends were deployed. You were just immersed in that culture in that community. And then when they got out, they just kept that more than a foot In past life, and so I recognized that and thought, okay, when when I make this break, I'm gonna make a clean break both physically and psychologically. So we picked up left Coronado, California, and moved to the mountains and wanted to raise our kids up here in a ski town. And at the same time you have used that. That background is it makes me who I am today, as a huge part of who I am today. Hopefully, it makes me a better writer, that their father a better husband, a better citizen, but at the same time, I don't live back there. Move forward, I'm going to continue to write these novels going forward. They're working on the fourth
scott huesing 9:33
deal, for lack of a better word, jack, do you feel some sense of, I don't know. Pity or sadness for guys that can't let go of the past in that, in that sense that they're, they're constantly revisiting the the battle days or the camaraderie that you share in the military, and then they just can't let it go. I mean, do you feel bad for those people? And if I mean, that's the hard way to put it, because I'm not disparaging that because it's important to stay connected. How do you how do you transcend that
Unknown Speaker 10:00
Yeah, no Don't feel bad at all I remember he has a different path. My path just didn't doesn't include the living back there. It includes using that background to move forward, because it is such a big part of me. So I did it for so long did it for 20 years at some very visceral powerful experiences downrange. Very, I feel very fortunate, also that I have all my fingers and toes and emerged relatively unscathed from those experiences, but so don't feel bad. It's just everybody has a different path. And mine happens to be making that clean break and moving forward and moving onward and identifying that next purpose which is taking care of my family, and then following that next passion and that next goal that I had from a very early age which is writing these types of novels, so So yeah, no, I don't think about that too much. It's just everyone has a different way to live and deal with life and, and to live it so
scott huesing 10:53
you do I agree. 100%
Pete Turner 10:55
but let's be honest, though, at your compound up there in the mountains, you still got a hell a pad in case commando happens in real life, like you were still ready to be pulled back.
Jack Carr 11:04
That's that movie was very, very influential in a very early age. So I won't deny that we are prepared in a similar fashion, if anybody comes calling
Pete Turner 11:13
you, by the way because you know we're at with this stuff. Absolutely what I was about to and I didn't know this going in when I was about to go to the army, I was working at Costco and another guy who's in the same situation as me didn't have enough experience had a college degree. We couldn't break through and do anything. He was like dear Tom Clancy books as restocking Tom Clancy books on the shelves and Costco and you know, sure enough Yes, I did. Next thing you know, like literally not even six weeks later, I'm in the army going to go be a spy, you know, so those books have an impact on on the day, guys like us, me, you know, talk.
Unknown Speaker 11:49
Yeah, they certainly influenced me. Yeah. And Funny enough, when I went into the military back then you had to choose what's called a source rating for buds so you're like an MLS, but you Did it before showing up at budds. Because the Navy thought that, hey, 80% of these people are going to wash out of this program. And so let's train them up and whatever they're going to be whatever their specialty is going to be beforehand. And then as soon as they wash out, off, they go to their job, whether whatever that is whether it's machinist made, post was made gunner's mate, whatever that might be. And I chose intelligence. So I went to an intelligence school in Danville, Virginia. And I'll tell you what, everything I sailed through that course, not because of what we learned in the classroom there, but because of all the Tom Clancy novels I had read, growing up, and that is a 100%. True. So I did not have to do very much studying in that 16 week school. I already had that knowledge going up. And interestingly enough, some of the things that get redacted from my house today are things that I learned and read about well before I went into the military, some things in junior high school, so it's a it's pretty ridiculous.
Pete Turner 12:53
Tom Clancy had to fight that court all the time to is like you realize that's in Jane's like already open knowledge So I'm looking at your books right now terminal lists, savage sun and true believer. Talk to us give us an idea. Is it a series? Do you write individual books? How does your universe work?
Unknown Speaker 13:10
Yeah, so the first one, like I wrote down about 5678 different ideas as I started so still in the military did about a one page executive summary on these different ideas. And I chose the one that I thought would be the most primal, the most visceral, the most hard hitting, and the most likely to be picked up by New York publishing house. So that one was the terminal list. And it was kind of up in the air between that one and savage sun, which is the third one, but I knew that I had to develop the characters to get them to a point where I could explore the theme of savage sun so for the first one, revenge without constraint, and I had a little yellow sticky on my computer that had the word revenge on it, and I got that from Steven pressfield. Who, who did the same thing. I think I he did it on the typewriter, but I had it on my little apple here, Steve He's still an old marine. That's right. He'll memory and handle. Yeah, no, of course wrote Legend of Bagger Vance and the Afghan campaign and gets a flyer and then a series of books on creativity of the War of Art, turning pro x wing, just an amazing guy. But I took his advice and put that yellow sticky there so that if either a sentence or a paragraph, chapter or something didn't directly or indirectly lead back to that theme of revenge, that I edited it out, it was gone right away. And that really kept me on track. And I think that's why once he got to New York, there were hardly any edits. There was a couple like one was what we really say this year, what do you think this year and then a third one, I don't remember. But I expected a ton of edits, content and edits, but there were hardly any. And I think that's because I stayed on theme because of Steven pressfield. So that was when I explored first and really, because I I loved books with the theme of revenge. I love movies with the theme of revenge. You know, it seems like people in general Like that theme because things you can't do in real life, you can escape and get them done in the pages of a book or in an hour and a half, two hour movie. I think that goes back to early stories around the campfire, which is why I wanted it to were to stay very primal visceral for that first novel. But more than that, it's also a story of someone who comes back from Iraq and Afghanistan, and takes the tactics, techniques that worked so well against us from the enemy, and brings those to home soil as he unravel the conspiracy, and, and brings those tactics and techniques to the people that wronged him, his team, his family, and then a deeper level of people want to think about it. A little deeper, is about someone who served in Iraq and Afghanistan brings those wars home to the front doors of people who have been sending young men men and women to their deaths for close to 20 years now. So are you Jim Reese, is that you say? Based on better he's a much better shot than I am. But he's a primer as a former seal enlisted sniper who then becomes an officer. So he has a background similar to mine. And I think why, why the book is so powerful is that and why it resonated with New York who sees thousands of these books every year is because the emotions, the feelings that the protagonist feels in the novels are things that I felt at some point down range, so I just took those feelings took those emotions and apply them to a completely fictional narrative. Sure, sure. I think that I mean, you
scott huesing 16:31
you got to write what you know, and that makes the writing easier, more fluid. And you mentioned revenge that that, that emotion of exacting revenge on the bad guy and mean, did you have that in Iraq? Did you exact revenge on those who were protecting you and your your shipmates?
Unknown Speaker 16:52
I don't think I put that much thought into it that there. It was more professional than that, I think. And sure, you know, you get answered Whatever something happens, you lose somebody the the Marines you're working with lose somebody, whatever it is, it wasn't. It was a war. So for me, I don't have to think about that enemy is adapting to us. We're adapting to them, we need to do it faster problems that, for me, added solve that problem said, How do you adapt faster than the enemy? How you disrupt this mail destroy these different networks. So for me, rather than it wasn't personal as far as revenge goes, maybe at the beginning, I had some of those thoughts right after 911 to go back and really search through the memory banks because it's been a while. But really, it was just time to do the job before September 11. It was our job to prepare for war, September 11 came and now it's time to go to war. It was really as simple as that.
scott huesing 17:45
How do you balance that in your head as an artist Now, having to understand the industry of of writing what sells and infusing your own ethics into that because that's interesting because this professional war fighters We are held to a higher standard and and you have to take those experiences and and I talk about that often about the law of war and our code of conduct and everything we're held to to a higher standard that that makes us better that makes America number one in our military. So great. How do you balance that? The ethics.
Unknown Speaker 18:23
I talk to my guys about it a lot. And I thought about that a lot. And I incorporated it into all of our training blocks. So really, we trained up for about 18 months, and we deploy for around six back we do it all again, but didn't want the morals and ethics, that part of it to be one brief that maybe they got from a jag, who came in for a half hour as they're thinking about other things. Maybe everyone's not there, and then they're downrange. And the first time they think about this is when they have someone in flux cuffs who just killed somebody in the platoon. So I needed I knew how important it was to talk about that ahead of time and make that a part of our training, especially as a leader, I thought that was my responsibility. So I often talk about how it is important that we maintain the moral high ground. Because sometimes that's about all that differentiates us from the enemy for us. So once you have someone in Black Ops no matter what they just did, now, as Americans, it's our responsibility to take care of that person, no matter how hard that is. That's just how it goes. You know, your time to put them in the ground is when you enter that room and there, they have that AK that's the time to put them in the ground. If you don't do it, then for some reason, and now they're in custody, well, now they need to be taken back, exploit them for intelligence, interrogate them, and hopefully go out maybe that same night and keep dismantling that network. So but talking about it, and not just assuming that guys are going to understand because they went to sere school because they got one brief from a gym bag. We've never been in that situation and it's just regurgitating some, some copy from a text or from a slide that supposed to, to give that day or presentation. It's it's important as leaders to discuss that ahead of time and make that a part of our training, not just the tactics, techniques and procedures that allows us to go in and crush the enemy.
Pete Turner 20:14
Is that true of your characters? Or because they're from fantasy land, you can make them a little more vindictive, you can make them a little more dangerous, or, you know, you can play with their struggle more openly. I mean, obviously, you guys aren't sitting there, the team's going, I really struggle ethically with what we're doing. I've considered you know, like that this doesn't happen like that.
Unknown Speaker 20:34
No, it's got no, that's why this is Yeah, this is fiction. So this is the, you know, being able to explore that sort of thing in a way that that entertains that takes people on a journey, but you know, just like it with the Tom Clancy novels, or just like I did with those other novels from David Morel and Nelson Demille. Growing up I learned a ton from reading those novels, even though they were fiction. And it also helps instill in me a love of reading. Not just fiction, but but nonfiction in the story. affection, all of that. And I think that makes me a big part of who I am today. So, so if yes, I do get to explore that through through these fictional characters and fictional scenarios, although there's enough realism in there that keeps it keeps it authentic. So that's why I wanted to take away absolutely everything cuz I remember growing up the voiceover in those movies, I used to live that way, say, you know, he had nothing left to lose. And I was like, well, he could die, he could always die. So I wanted to really go back to that old that the Shuto how Samurai would go into into battle in ancient Japan, thinking they were already dead, because that made them more effective and efficient lawyers. So I thought how do you do that today? How do you do that to a modern lawyer? How do you take away everything and then put him into combat thinking he is already dead? And that's the conspiracy I came up with that I got really God from the church hearings that took place in the 70s that expose a lot of overreach let's say by certain government agencies, CIA a particular like what what what kind of time has passed since the church hearings where somebody didn't get the memo. And they've gone back and are now testing out a drug on our nation's most elite lawyers that have some side effects. And that's really what kicks off the premise and the conspiracy in the first novel, The term analysts, so it's, it gets answered, the question is, yeah, you get to explore all that, through the medium of a fictional thriller, which is a blast from it
Pete Turner 22:21
strikes me as funny, you know, like, all three of us have seen a lot of time in combat zone. So when you get briefed by a jag on how to be risk adverse and avoid, avoid that, you know, dangerous things like, but you realize, like, all we do our dangerous things, like you're asking us to put this totally unrealistic lens on what's happening. And by the way, our peers across the street from us are not doing the same thing and we've got to adapt to you know, that environment is that it struck me as funny and, you know, Scott, I'm sure it has something to say about that. But like that Scott talks about the friction, of combat and and those things Like I think of friction in terms of logistics, like how many times in Iraq that I sit in a chair, and have it just completely shatter underneath me or I go up to a door and the door no longer opens and I'm like, Fuck, now I've got to spend 45 minutes trying to unfuck this door, so I can go into my office or whatever it is, right? Like, all of these things. Does any of that stuff leak into your books at all?
Unknown Speaker 23:20
Oh, yeah. Not on that level. Not on the I would say the administrative tactical level, but more on the strategic level decisions that are made by people sitting in comfortable chairs back in Washington or in Northern Virginia. So that that definitely creeps in more than creeps in with senior level military leaders and politicians in particular. So you get to I get to take some of those those emotions. And I guess that comes from if we had made the same type of decisions tactically, that our senior level leaders made strategically, we would have been court martialed, thrown out of the military, but senior level military leaders, senior level politicians, make these Some atrocious strategic level decision and you just continue on stay in office and get promoted. You mean like download
scott huesing 24:07
a secret that that's what I love to supernet on a hard drive and then just pain and and off to the penny officers like this for me
Jack Carr 24:14
it's a it's it's great for I guess it's very therapeutic I should say that I get to explore those things through the medium of a
scott huesing 24:22
connection. That's gotta be Yeah, that's gonna be liberating. Do you use the the, this genre this medium to, to really purge all that stuff that people want to say and you don't have any, I guess repercussions because when you write nonfiction, everyone often asked, Did you send this to department defense gate clerks? I'm like, No, I didn't because I wasn't given any way trade secrets or anything confidential but a lot of guys have to go through that process. You don't because it's fiction. And I think that that opens yourself up a little bit. Talk to me about the critics when they read your stuff. On accuracy and using that as kind of, especially the politics, man, because you're all over Twitter too. And you know, you don't dabble too much in the politics. But how do you deal with the critics?
Unknown Speaker 25:11
Yeah, it's interesting, because this is a whole new thing for me. So I'm really just three years into this. And before I started down this path, I didn't have a Facebook account. Back in the early days, I didn't have a MySpace account, didn't have Instagram, Twitter didn't want any of those sorts of things, and just saw them as nothing good could have come from those had I had any of those accounts while in the military. Now it's a little different. Now. That's weird. Now you're the outlier coming in if you don't have that, electronic history, but that's, that's another discussion altogether. So delving into this what has been an education and just like on the battlefield, I look at these things as as opportunities that weren't there. 20 years ago, 30 years ago for authors, just like this podcast wasn't around 30 years ago, 20 years ago. For an author to do to reach an audience or help build a readership, but part of that is now you are much more accessible. And especially if you're here, just like you're building any business and you're out there, and you make a comment here, or you post something there, you are now open to every single person that has a cell phone or a computer, and they can all let you know exactly how they feel about whatever you posted, or whatever you wrote in your novel, and there's no filter, there's no editorial board. There's no in the 60s 70s 80s 90s so everybody gets there gets their say, so I don't spend too much time dwelling on it and the way I look at negative reviews, or the people that are super critical tactic crazy is that hey, you know what they're doing, they're just selling a book to a person that's gonna like it for the exact reason that this person does. So when I see that person writing something about too violent To political to right wing or whatever it may be, Okay, you know what, this is just selling it to the person that's looking for that exact thing. So surely you crazy person on Amazon review or Goodreads or wherever you are. So I look at it like that I try to put that that little positive type spin on it so, so that I don't go crazy and I don't respond to
scott huesing 27:19
it as a as a guy that learned more about social media at age 46. When I started into this realm, the one rule I set for myself is don't ever respond to the crazy because once you start drinking the poison, it's, it's, it's gonna kill you and you just cannot do that. I think that you're probably you're probably inundated with a tea you got a big readership The books are hugely popular. And you do have to deal with that. I mean, do you if you manage your own social media?
Unknown Speaker 27:50
Yeah, yeah. About that stage where I'm gonna maybe need some help here soon or something, but it's, I try to respond to everyone. Thank you. Every one because I'm sincerely appreciative that, that the people are reading the novels telling their friends about it. And really, it's modern day word of mouth. So the way I look at social media is that hey, that's my storefront. Just like if I owned a general store in small town America, and someone came in and I behind the counter, and they asked me, Hey, where can I get some cereal? Absolutely. A man said, Hey, I'm looking for directions to the Interstate, whatever it is, and I'm gonna treat them the same way people on social media the same way I would if I was behind that counter in my general store. So that's the way I look when I look at it. And same thing if someone crazy comes in, you know, you're gonna want to escort them out as soon as possible, which is the block feature on social media, which I am a huge fan of. So really, anything negative, anything crazy block, you're done. So that's kind of the way the way I look at it and deal with it. And I try not to I try. I don't go down any rabbit holes because I don't have time. When someone wants to engage on something political or some sort of issue like there's just there's just not time that they For me to do that, and that's not, that's not what I do. So I just maybe give a little heart and move on. Or if it's crazy, then you blocked. But really, it's, it's really just a way for me to thank people and also offer something of value. So that's why I'm not just promoting myself on social media, don't use it just as an advertising platform. Use it as a way to engage and offer hopefully something of value to people that go to that page and learn a little bit about history, terrorist events. learn a little bit more about me get behind the curtain, and maybe inspire people with a little bit of my journey and show that it's possible and don't pay attention to the odds make the life you want to get out there and get after it. So that's, uh, that's kind of how I look at social media.
Pete Turner 29:41
Speaking of social media and podcasts that didn't exist there two years ago, you are on a podcast, you can talk to 80 different countries right now where we have active listeners, tell them why they want to go out and buy your book. Here's your chance to elevator pitch. I don't know thousands of people. 10s of thousands have been
Unknown Speaker 29:56
nice. I love it. So much. That's a tough one. Because because I just do the job, and I'm not really I'm not when I market or when I talk about it, I'm not really, you know, selling, I guess I'm selling my book, but it's kind of a secondary, it's kind of, in addition to whatever value hopefully I'm offering. But these are novels where they feel real. They're a complete fiction, and you go on a journey, just like you would in any movie, or any book in the genre, those emotions and those feelings that the protagonist feels are real. I didn't interview someone who was in Special Operations, and then think about how they would feel about doing something. No, that's how I felt doing those things. And that's how the that comes across in the novel. And that's why I think that's why they're, they're doing so well. So if you want that kind of a journey, and when I get a little bit of a peek into the mind of a special operations lawyer in the through the medium of political thriller, then pick these up. And I'd suggest starting with the first one because it's there, continue and they're all part of the journey for a character. The second one A true believer. It's really a novel of redemption. And it's about someone who goes on a transformative journey, just like we all do when we leave the military. So I tap into those feelings. What does it feel like to leave that and move on to something else, because that's what the character has to do. In the second novel, he has to learn how to live again, find his next purpose, find his next mission. And then the third one is the savage son. And that's where we explore the dark side of man through the through the hunter hunted dynamic. And that was inspired by the most dangerous game that I read back in sixth grade. So back then even sixth grade, I knew that one day I'd write a modern thriller that paid tribute to that classic tale. So savage son is that book
Pete Turner 31:40
is the most dangerous game. Is that the ICT version? Or is it
Unknown Speaker 31:44
nice? I like that you knew that. You know, it's a bit goes back to my original to the original Richard Connell. 1924 short story. And yeah. So anybody that knows that, that story should should get a kick out of savage son.
Pete Turner 31:58
Hey, this is Pete. Turner from lions rock productions, we create podcasts around here. And if you your brand or your company want to figure out how to do a podcast, just talk to me, I'll give you the advice on the right gear, the best plan to show you how to take a podcast that makes sense for you that's sustainable. That's scalable and fun. Hit me up at Pete at breakdown, show calm, let me help. I want to hear about that. So anybody that knows that that story should should get a kick out of savage son. When you start a new career like this, there's the dream of what it is. And obviously, the reality is going to be different. But what are some of the things you're like, you know, I love writing, but I really don't have a lot of time for x, or I really didn't realize this was gonna be so hard. Like, for example, if you get to, I think it's 2500 reviews in your book, it'll make money for the rest of your life. It'll constantly so it'll never stop. But But whoever thought about vacuum No, I'm trying to write a good book. What are some of those things you've picked up? You're like, you know, this is part of the business and it's not always pretty, but I sure wish I could replace this with something else.
Jack Carr 32:59
While I did not know that about the 2500, so thank you for passing that along. And I don't think that
Unknown Speaker 33:05
the interesting, no.
scott huesing 33:08
He's way smarter than me. Everyone has
Unknown Speaker 33:10
no idea. But so for me it was I didn't know that there was a business side of this. And all I thought, as I got ready to get out of the military and started doing this, and then even when that gave it to New York, and I didn't even know I needed an agent. I'm glad I didn't, because I might not have these books out today, had I known that I didn't know there was a business side to this, I thought you just wrote and you can live it up cabin in the mountains and send it to New York. And I thought, okay, there's some edits to go back and forth. But that's it. I did not know that you everything you have to do as an author, the same things you'd have to do if you were starting any business. So all the marketing and the branding and the CO branding and the advertising, social media, the engagement budgets, everything you have to do as an author, but really, you're building, it's a startup, and it's just like you would start a startup or anything in your garage. I did not know that that was the case. I mean, a few months out, I was like, I guess I need a website. So I guess I should have one of those. And I guess I'm gonna have to do some social media. So if you go to the bottom of my Instagram, you'll see there's, like, no pictures of me. And then I, you can kind of trace my progression, and then I discover filters. And then I like put a picture of me, like from my back there, you can see my backpack and like the side of a little bit of the side of my head, and then it kind of goes and you can see the progression, if you go to the bottom and work your way up. But it was, it was, I guess, a shock that it wasn't just writing and then sending a manuscript in New York, it was all these other things. But for me, as soon as I realized that, then I looked at them and say, these are all opportunities. And these are all opportunities that other authors that started up in the 70s and 80s did not have, and I have them today. So how do I take advantage of this momentum? How do I take advantage of these emerging opportunities just like I would on the battlefield, and how do I offer people something of value, and that's really what it was was all about. So I've constantly learning and constantly adapting just like I would on the battlefield. And that's how I look at it. Although the repercussions from doing something making a bad decision are a lot less dire, and that my guys aren't going to be coming home in inboxes. And that's, so for me, that's, I can solve those problems on the written page, and I can figure out those problems. Not necessary, I don't have to do them in real time on the battlefield with bullets flying. As far as the business side of this, I can take a breath, I can think about things and then make the best decision as I move forward.
scott huesing 35:33
That's a great message that's constantly reinforced on every episode that we've had any type of veteran artist on as you could write a best seller in your basement or in their cabin in the woods. But if you're not willing to turn the hat around, and become a businessman, marketing promotion, because Simon and Schuster is only going to be so much big publishing houses only gonna do so much if you're not willing to give of yourself. You're going to be one of those guys that says, boy Why isn't my story doing well? Why am I not selling these books because it's not just putting fingers on the keyboard and then sending it to your editor. There's so much more. And you just nailed that. And it's a great message for any veteran, especially any writer that wants to share a story because veterans don't own great stories. Were just a part of it. So to hear that time and again, is really powerful. It's inspiring, for the best word I could find. And you're doing that. Let's talk about your involvement now with the terminal list and Chris Pratt, let's let's talk about that. Yes, that's right. And that's, that's some good stuff. Can we talk about that?
Unknown Speaker 36:43
Absolutely. I couldn't talk about it until now. But now that they've, they've announced it. I can talk about it. Yeah, Chris. optioned it before it even came out. So before it's a it hits shelves in March of 2018, is when it came out on the publication date. Before then he optioned it. And the crazy part of this is as I was writing, I thought of Not, not who my character would be, but who could play my character who would be the best person to play James Reese. And it's so crazy because as I'm writing this Chris is doing Parks and Rec in a very small part in Zero Dark 30, which is probably what I guess subliminally in my head made me think of him as the person, the one person I thought about to play James Reese, as I was writing, which is so crazy, and to have that happen, and I also thought of that one director, I thought of directing. This was anti Foucault. Hmm. So out of both those people and now they're the two people that are involved in making this happen. So it's just yeah, crazy story how how all that came about, but I feel so fortunate and you can still derail so I'll give you my expectations very low so I can do,
scott huesing 37:54
Chris Pratt can grow a good beard, which is essential for playing your character because you can go Got no beard. I don't know if James Reese does but yeah, I don't know if James Reese goes beard no beard but Yeah, you do. I like that. Yeah.
Unknown Speaker 38:06
It is amazing guys such such a great guy we've spent so we spent a little time together here last year. Yeah, there's I could not think there's a lot of trust because we had had three different options on the table. And I chose Korea there was no question. I was going to choose Chris because it's a lot of trust involved. And for me, thinking about him playing this character as I was writing it, and then having it come to fruition and him wanting it before it even came out before anybody even knew that I existed, or this book existed. It was just Hey, the stars are aligning here. And this makes sense. And even if it doesn't happen is the right decision.
scott huesing 38:42
Was your was your decision based in any part by the fact that Chris has been very vocal in Hollywood about support for the military, and which lends itself to being more conservative in a lot of regards.
Unknown Speaker 38:56
I mean, it would have had I needed to factor that in but I did need to factor that in at all? It was more of the Hey, I thought of this person playing this role. Now he wants it there's no way that I should go with anyone else. Don't get greedy. So, so I went with with Chris, of course has always been, yeah, but no, it does certainly help that he does have a mindset similar to mine in a lot of respects. And I think that he's at that stage in his, in his career where just like, like Tom Hanks in the 80s we all grew up with him, you know, Joe versus Yeah, or, or us or whatever else and then all of a sudden now he exactly and then all of a sudden he does. He has Philadelphia and you know total one ad for him as an actor. And now and from then on he could choose his any role he wanted just shows the versatility, took a risk, and it worked out and that really gave him the options and opportunities to do what he's done says and I thought you know what, Chris is amazing, amazing guy. He's obviously has, he's at that stage where he needs to do something like that as well do something that's a little darker, that shows his range as an actor. So the more more physical and, and this is, this is that role. And you recognize that as well. And he chose that I feel very honored that he's chosen this story to be that role for him. So yeah, fingers crossed. And I, I've been working on the script for the last month or so as an advisor to the screenwriter, who's an amazing guy, and I could not be more happy with what they've done with that. It's so cool. And it's so it's so educational for me to see this process and see how they do it, how it evolves. And so for me, I've just been so thankful to be here.
Pete Turner 40:43
I want to make sure I make this comment so we don't get too far past it. I'm wondering when someone is going to discover that Tom Hanks did a movie as a cross dressing, you know, like, like Bosom Buddies couldn't be made today. Like it would be too offensive for everybody. And it's like they have no idea. Did it You know and so when they discover this although the world's gonna end but just to comment for the audience to enjoy but the question I want to ask you about this is how one so look you're just some dumb seal on the team's How the hell does Chris Pratt find your book?
Unknown Speaker 41:15
Yeah, so that's that's a great story to see how do I go about talking about this because I want to make sure that I talk to all the people involved and make sure I get there go ahead but I got a call out of the blue in the fall of 2017. So before the books come out from an old buddy from the teams and I hadn't talked to him in five years or so and great guy and he calls me in and says in so this is gonna be about the gala gala came out. I don't even know what a galley was until right about this time. And so a galley copy is a is a pre release of a novel. It's in like a paperback type form. It's still a rough draft. For all practical purposes, that comes out and goes to reviewers and influencers ahead of publication dates so they can get blurbs. Other authors you blurb reviewers. do reviews Ready to go? That sort of thing? So I had those my friend calls and, and says, Hey, you know, do you remember me? I'm like, of course, how's it going? And he says, Well, you know, I was wondering, thank you for what you did for me in the seal teams. And I was like, oh, man, what did I get him out of jail? And I, you know, go into the memory banks of all the variances. I had over 20 years and the teams with everybody, you know, it was very simple thing. And we sat down in my office, he was getting ready to get out. And we talked about transition. And we introduced him to a couple people in the private sector. And just like I would do for, for any good guy leaving the seal teams, or somebody who's staying in the seal teams that just needs a little advice on their path. But anyway, it's a that made an impact with him. And he wanted to call and say thank you, and I was like, absolutely, man, it's my pleasure. And he said, I already have a book coming out. And I said, Yeah, I got a book coming out. It's a come out in a few months. So these galley copy things. If you want to take a look at it, I'd love to send you one and he said, You I'd be grateful to check it out. But I'd also like to give one to a friend of mine. And I'm like, Oh, yeah, no problem is that. And this is Chris Pratt. Like, Oh, that's interesting, because that's the one person I thought it was. I was writing novels playing this character. So anyway, that's how that came about, and sent it off. And Chris read it and loved it. And next thing, you know, he's optioned it. So it's a very, very cool both those guys are are just outstanding human beings in general. And if Chris wasn't an actor, you know, we'd be doing things together, regardless because he's such a such a great guy. And yeah, I feel very fortunate that things are are on this path. But once again, want to keep expectations low thanks and go off the rails in Hollywood at anytime, so don't want to be disappointed if it if it doesn't happen. So I gotta manage those expectations as well. Just feel fortunate that it's as far as it is.
Pete Turner 43:50
And are you adapting the screenplay yourself or someone else or adapting the book into a screenplay for you
Unknown Speaker 43:55
know, David Giulio, who's an awesome guy, he's the showrunner screenwriter. I'm just assisting mostly in the technical side of things, and really just learning. Yeah, I wanted them to have I want them to the best of the professionals kind of like people ask me, Hey, did you read your audiobook? No, I want the best guy out there reading my audio book. And that's Ray Porter, who's amazing. And he has a huge following way people follow him from a like they do with all these top narrators follow them from project to project rather than author to author of all audio books, they'll follow a narrator to different projects. I didn't really know that. But yeah, I want the best narrator out there doing the audio book. I want the best screenwriter out there adapting it for film. And so I'm just assisting in and learning which is really cool. But uh, yeah, it's it's fantastic. I couldn't be more excited about the team they put together for this
scott huesing 44:44
now. That's great, man. Does anyone ever ask you the question? Why don't you read your own book?
Unknown Speaker 44:49
Yeah, yeah, I get that a lot. Got a lot and has that same answer. You know what the best guy out there reading it. And I didn't really think about how people follow narrators wrote different projects at all. I realized that way after I chose re border, and I just chose reporter because Simon and Schuster called me one afternoon and said, Hey, who do you want to read your audiobook? And I was like, I don't know, because I'm really, I'm a reader, I read guide, I need that physical book there. So I'm not really an audio book person. And they will just let us know, by the end of the day, it was like two in the afternoon, you know, like, like, give me like an hour New York time, as I started listening to the samples and all these different books, and just like sample sample sample, and then I listened to Ray and I was like, Oh, that's good. And I was a bunch of his other ones samples from other things that he's done. And this is the guy and luckily, he had this huge following. I had no idea. And then it got nominated for best audio book of the year last year, which was great. So we got to go to New York and put on the taxes and hang out in person together. And he's just a fantastic guy, as well. And it was so cool to see it up there next to Stephen King and next to Ruth were Ruth were one, but it was just so So cool to see it up there with all those people that that have been writing for so long and are just fans such fantastic authors. So, yeah, very cool. But I think if I did ever did some sort of a nonfiction type deal, and it wouldn't be, you know, an autobiography of what I did in the teams or anything, there's some other ideas I have in that realm. But if I did something there, then I would probably read that one myself.
scott huesing 46:22
And that's something they don't tell you. I didn't. I wish I would have gotten that information two years ago as well there three years ago when we were developing it, but I think you're one of the rare exceptions to I was in New York doing a, I think, a Veterans Day event and I reached out to Dave and ran into red echo in Ramadi. And one striking fact came up at dinner. He said, You're the first author I've ever met, because we're so dispersed, but I thought that was rare but to get to meet the guy that reads you.
Unknown Speaker 46:52
That's pretty cool. So cool. Yeah. And if you if we didn't do meet up in New York out of flown out to LA and would have a beer out there. But yeah, it's I think it's important to have that personal connection, especially if it's somebody that's a great guy like I just lucked out that Ray happens to be a great guy. If he wasn't to be a different story, I don't know what I do. I get to be selling books, I'd stick with it. But he just happens to be an amazing person. And we get along great. And he's just, yeah, it's super fun to work with people that are cool that you're friends with. You know, it's, I feel very fortunate in that respect. Across the board, everybody. Simon Schuster is amazing. my publicist is amazing. My editor publisher, Emily besler, she's a she published in school and continues to publish in with the Kyle Mills, novels, polishes, adore this all this entire team. I just could not be more fortunate to have so many great people working on this with me,
Pete Turner 47:46
Hey, tell us what's next. I mean, obviously, you're writing more books, but what's out there on the horizon? Obviously, you have the Chris Pratt project, and that's cool. But like you said, you know, temporary expectations, what but what's out there, it's in your control that we can expect from you.
Unknown Speaker 47:58
Yep. So it's booked For his work now I finished the final edits to book three to savage son just a couple nights ago. Because I go back and forth a few times, and then people start fighting. When these galleys come out, people start noticing little, little mistakes here and there mostly grammar that they haven't been taught up to that point. It's amazing how the human brain works. I mean, you've read a sentence thousands of times, and you know what should be there. So your brain puts it there. But it's not really there. Someone else catches it, it's reading it for the first time when and that shouldn't be an A, or should be an and, but your mind is just thrown the D in there, take him out the end, because that's how the sense should read. It's incredible. It's always fascinating to me. So I finished that just a couple nights ago. And that means that after this podcast, I go 100% full force into book four. I'm super excited about it. It's all outlined. I've started it, and now it's just continuing to look for those emerging opportunities and solve those problems on the page which is what I love because in the outline section This holds true for the first novel through the third and end of the fourth. If I ran into a problem in that outline, I didn't get discouraged. I didn't say I didn't stop and wait until I figured out that problem until I moved on. I just went over it, I put a little question mark put a little x and continued to move forward. Because I knew that I had time, I had time to go back on the battlefield, I didn't hear I do. So I'm confident that in the year that it takes to do these, I will figure out and that problem as I work through this novel, and then I go back to it later. And that really helps keep things moving forward. So that's what will be happening here in the next weeks and months. Is that all those things that I skipped over in book four, because I didn't have the answer right there. But I didn't want it to hold me up. Well, those will start getting solved as I immerse myself deeper and deeper into the plot into the characters into the theme as I continue to push forward. So that's really the focus of the next few months and then paperback book of truth. lever that comes out February 25. So I have a bunch of bunch of things that are coming out for this content wise around that. And then April 14 is savage son. So there'll be a build up to that as well with a different content and a book tour, all that sort of thing, a book festival in Florida. So there's all these little one offs here and there that keeps me busy, that are part of the business side of this, that are not just the writing side of this. So really figuring out that, that balance and you know, sometimes it swings all the way to the business side, and then sometimes it swings all the way back to the to the writing side. And sometimes it's in the middle going back and forth. So it's, you got to get it all. You got to get it all. It's all it's all part. That's all part of being a professional writer professional. You've got it all that's on your website in addition to you get geared merchandise and you know, our friend, Eli crane bottle breacher there's some cool stuff there and you also support multiple charities through offering those pieces of merchandise up in the books. Never So just tell everybody where where to go where to find jack. So official jack car.com is the website and for people that want a little more deep dive into some of the weapons or what I use in the books, what I used in the military, there's that informations out there on the blog on the website, so they can check all that out. And then there's a link to jack Carr usa.com, which is the merchandise and really, I didn't want to just, you know, get a few followers or people or whatever and throw a hat or a T shirt up and try to make some money off it. I went didn't that didn't really sit right with me. So but I still want to but people have asked me about it, and I wanted to
Unknown Speaker 51:37
do something. And so what I did was I figured out a few different things that are personal to me, like bottle breacher. I had that connection to Eli. There's a really cool bookmark made out of copper. They're all handmade and have a 556 shell that hangs off the end. I went to mark your place in a novel. That's a veteran owned business. So there's a few things up there on the website. jack Carr USA, but all the profits go to veteran focused foundations and those are highlighted on the side as well. And there are veteran foundations that have a personal connection to so they didn't just pick one out of a hat that sounded cool or had a cool website or something like that. I have a personal connection to each and every one of those veteran focus foundations and those are explained and highlighted on that webpage. So that's out there and then on the social media front it's jet car at jet car USA, on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter. But three was too many three was one of my going to So Facebook just repost from Instagram so people at Facebook don't get get mad because it's not you know, I'm not responding to anything. It just happens to repost there. So there is a Facebook page but I try to get back to each and every person on Instagram and Twitter. And you can sign up for the for my newsletter as well and every month I have a reading list that comes out six books from my reading list will be highlighted Each month I've been doing that since October, in the series readers like that, because I give a little paragraph or two on why each book was impactful to me at a certain stage in my life, either as a writer or as a military professional and why. So that's, that's out there as well. So, so I'm out there active in those spaces. And I really do appreciate everybody that reaches out, because they're the reason that I can I can do this and that I've been able to transition into this next stage of my life and I really appreciate all the the word of mouth that has made this a success because I didn't come from a background in politics or sports or have a following from something. It was from nothing. And it was the word of mouth from readers that made this book or these books now. Such a success, so be forever grateful for that. I love it.
Pete Turner 53:53
I love it. Now you got to read Scott's book and and do the big recommendation
Unknown Speaker 53:57
I had right here. I have it right here. Absolutely. Yep, we got we got to meet that at shacho and hang out for a bit. So yeah, I'm looking forward to the Ross Minsky. Yep. Yeah, yep. What a great guy. So
Unknown Speaker 54:10
Ross
Unknown Speaker 54:12
Yep, I'll see him in the door then you knocked in April. We're gonna do a little thing of the shooting range out there as part of the tour in Colorado. So looking forward to seeing him out there.
Pete Turner 54:23
Thanks for coming on the show man. I appreciate it. You're always welcome to come back on and I know people will dig your books because they are audience one of the things you know you don't get to pick what happens but audience likes to buy books and read them and I get feedback all the time on positive things. Just the other day one of people from the audience was reading Scott's book all the way the other side of the world other hemisphere another day of the of the week. You know where they live? It's so far away. But there she is reading Scott's book. So these these things move and I appreciate it and everybody who buys the book, do go on to Amazon rate and review it. You have to do that because it's that's money for an author
Unknown Speaker 55:00
You know what I didn't really realize that at all like I didn't do any research into this space other than just dive in but they do help and what I also encourage people to do since we're talking about it is to go to their favorite books and read the bad reviews on their favorite books because you'll see like how crazy it can be and how someone will say get like a one star book coming with a torn cover from Amazon of course has nothing to do with what's in the book Yeah. Or but it's still it drags down
scott huesing 55:28
yeah but and you also hear if you don't know this also click on the reviewers profile and see what else they reviewed if they reviewed 50 books or they reviewed one book give it a one star review and also they have like this egg beater and exercise machine and diapers hilarious.
Unknown Speaker 55:42
Yeah, it's you
scott huesing 55:43
know, it's it's kind of skewed man, but I can't like dude.
Unknown Speaker 55:50
But the point being is that to counter those crazy ones on your favorite book, go to your favorite author or whatever else than that it's important to leave leave one and leave again. counter some of that craziness because yeah, you're right the person that reviews you know 13 egg beaters and then all of a sudden they were given a one star review because it came with a corn corn cover or because it's to right wing or whatever it may be.
scott huesing 56:15
Well, you can count on some fire support from from me Pete in a I just want to say thanks, man and keep keep up the fire brother. We're proud of you and, you know, love what you're doing out there.
Semper Fi. Thanks so much for the support. sincerely appreciate it and hopefully we'll meet up again in person soon.
